On drums...

Yes it's a difficult subject, it seems kids (under 16) or maybe up to young adults (well at the least the ones I talk to), wouldn't consider buying music anymore, they're happy to listen to music often of very low quality (over compressed resulting in distortion of high end - like on some Youtube files) on bud earphones which they rip from the internet or share with friends. I suppose the sharing with friends thing we've all done - running a vinyl onto cassette etc, but there is a vast difference for me ethically in doing that then putting it up on a torrent site for everyone and his wife to take. Like Kelly alluded to, is watching Youtube right? We all do it but i'd like to believe that it inspires people to track down the actual product and pay for it.
It would be nice but probably a bit idealistic to hope that if there was more education for kids (similar to what the article addresses) they may take more pride in owning something, yes potentially they would have fewer albums but at least they could invite their friends around and with pride look through each other's collections rather than scrolling through a million tracks on the ipod. Maybe i'm just getting old.
Kids are still coming through the system, learning their instruments, forming bands, aspiring to great things, and culturally music continues to plays an as important part in defining who we are as it always did, but the way things stand it can only get worse. Why will bands put out music? It still costs a fair bit of money to release an album and the potential for return, even breaking even is nominal especially for more niche groups, jazz etc. They say an album is like a business card these days, to promote live performance, but is there really the money in live performance. So musicians will have to scrape through life living in a garret for their art...
I remember reading something when Lars Ulrich of Metallica was trying to enforce taking everyone who stole their music to court, he continues to receive heavy criticism as if he is wrong to expect to be paid for his product...because he has enough money already?
Is there a solution other than through education?

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http://percusski.co.uk/

Interesting question, Nick. Education, as I understand the word, on moral issues only works assuming people believe in absolutes (or else they'll rationalize in favor of their own convenience), or if there are serious consequences for scoffing the law.

It is said, and I think it's true, that the law teaches. But law without consequences is just hot air. The way to stop stealing music is to successfully prosecute abusers. Surely government and industry could team up to protect the property of musicians and/or record companies. I'm not sure, however, that there is a will to do so. So many musicians can't get our Woodstock out of our Glastonbury far enough to realize, as Cliff says, what stealing is, and musicians are just the tip of that cultural iceberg. So who will enforce a law that benefits the very people who kind of think law is uncool?

Someone educate me about Youtube. Is looking at it illegal?

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Gregory

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Cliff

River City Trio

What if we did all have the same opinions?

I don't believe that looking at Youtube is illegal but the 'sharing' of material potentially is, and i understand that Youtube do enforce this when they are notified of a breach. Don't quote me but I believe that is the same for file sharing sites, the uploader is potentially prosecutable...but then again if I remember the Ulrich case - it targeted even those who downloaded as I guess that's the equivalent of receiving stolen goods...no I should have kept my mouth shut on this as I don't know lol.

I agree Greg - artists are very rarely business men. I do think if kids were targeted early enough and reasoned with (like the article tries to do in principle) there would be the potential to change behaviour, but as others have said the whole subject is so massive and unwieldy now that even though there are laws to protect artists, enforcing it would be impossible. Aiming the argument at anyone over 10 years is probably already a waste of time.

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http://percusski.co.uk/

It should be noted that when I stated we should all agree that stealing is not good and we should leave it at that, I was not suggesting end of the topic. I was merely avoiding the treading on rough ground when it comes to our own seperate convictions on morals, truth, ethics....Inevitably it will come down to religion, who believes in God and what shape and form one believes him to be, or not.
I respect everyone's opinion here and enjoy the fellowship.

Thank you Nick, Cliff and Greg for your last comments.
Cliff, there is nothing that I have looked for and needed musically that I have not found on youtube. NOTHING. It's really quite remarkable.
Which helps with my point. Youtube is also a guilty party. It must be, after all, anyone can go there and get free copyrighted material. I would really be okay if someone went after youtube and wish they would. My original gripe with the writer is his surprise and disgust with the multitudes at doing so and expects them to just repent.
Like Nick is saying, the current generation has the notion that paying for music is arcaic. It's for us old guys, from the 90's
Because that is how it has been for them. How they were brought up. They cannot have a conscience for something they don't even believe in.
Someone else, not the people getting free music, has let down the artist, muscian, music industry....
I hope you see a little bit of clarity in what I was trying to express

Kelly, perhaps you read the article more closely, but I didn't pick up surprise or disgust so much as I did compassion for those who have been led astray, along with a concurrent need to point out the moral principles to someone who publicly rationalized her lack thereof.

As to "separate convictions...," whether God exists is not where I was aiming. I don't see how the current topic can be addressed without reliance on an absolute, without which all is merely in flux and abhorrence of theft merely merely someone's passing sentiment (along with their passing property).

Let the implications of that fall where they may. It is no secret, I don't think, that I am a Christian, but I don't expect others to accept that theology just because I do. You may say, and you'd be right, that I only accept the notion of moral absolutes because of my theology. But that's just me; it is my nature to do whatever I like unless there is an authoritative reason not to.

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Gregory

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Cliff

River City Trio

What if we did all have the same opinions?

I'm remembering that, just in case.

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Gregory